Aircon...

[Mirez]

Anyone know how the charging machines work?

 

I had a slow leak on the galaxy (condenser dryer) which I've finally fixed after 3 months of no use, took it to kwikfit (yes I know I'm an idiot) for recharging. He set it going and all was well, midway though when I asked how things were going he said it hadn't detected a leak - so far so good, left the place with the car very jerky (ie the compressor working hard) but assumed it would get better as it hadn't been used in a while, aircon better then ever before.

 

My problem is the next day the compressor refused to engage yet no low pressure fault codes were stored and today (2 days later) its got a noticeable leak from the pipe running away from the compressor and its all pissed out again (complete with low pressure code)

 

My concern is that towards the end of the filling process he said I had duel aircon and I had to correct him. I believe the duel system takes 1050 and the single 750 which leads me to my question:

 

Will the machine overcharge if told the wrong thing? I'm of the opinion that its been overfilled making the compressor work out of spec and thats done some nasty damage. Proving that will obviously be a challange but am I barking up the wrong tree entirely?

[seatkid]

The operator enters the Make/Model/Year of the car via a menu system. Then there is usually a choice of several options, to cover different variants. The operator MUST choose the option that is correct (it states the weight of gas on the LCD). If he chose the wrong one, it will go ahead and charge the wrong quantity. I always stand over the shoulder to "assist" the selection process.

 

At the end, Kwikfit (used to) give you a summary report - pressures/temperatures before/after, how much gas/oil extracted and how much gas/oil recharged.

 

If the galaxy a/c is over or underfilled, then the 3 way pressure switch inhibits the compressor to prevent damage.

Edited June 22, 2009 by seatkid

[mikej]

Had exactly the same thing done to mine when i first got the galaxy with the exact same symptoms, they put in 1050g for a dual aircon system instead of the required 750g. When leaving i engaged the aircon and it was like driving with the handbrake on, suddenly i had a large screech, massive blast of air from under the car (pressure switch a bit late me thinks) and the stink of burning rubber and i almost went through the bloody windscreen at the same time, basically the compressor had seized and the belt was just dragging over the clutch. I emptied the remainder of the gas from the system and with the aircon off the car run ok although i did need a new Aux belt and compressor ! Go back and ask how much they put in.

mike..... :ph34r:

Edited June 22, 2009 by mikej

[roy202]

Anyone know how the charging machines work?

 

I had a slow leak on the galaxy (condenser dryer) which I've finally fixed after 3 months of no use, took it to kwikfit (yes I know I'm an idiot) for recharging. He set it going and all was well, midway though when I asked how things were going he said it hadn't detected a leak - so far so good, left the place with the car very jerky (ie the compressor working hard) but assumed it would get better as it hadn't been used in a while, aircon better then ever before.

 

My problem is the next day the compressor refused to engage yet no low pressure fault codes were stored and today (2 days later) its got a noticeable leak from the pipe running away from the compressor and its all pissed out again (complete with low pressure code)

 

My concern is that towards the end of the filling process he said I had duel aircon and I had to correct him. I believe the duel system takes 1050 and the single 750 which leads me to my question:

 

Will the machine overcharge if told the wrong thing? I'm of the opinion that its been overfilled making the compressor work out of spec and thats done some nasty damage. Proving that will obviously be a challange but am I barking up the wrong tree entirely?

sounds to me like you need to go down to qwikfit and tell them you want it sorted as they seem to be at fault, there is useually a sticker on the slam panel that tells you the amount of gas and oil your car needs...

[MrT]

sounds to me like you need to go down to qwikfit and tell them you want it sorted as they seem to be at fault, there is useually a sticker on the slam panel that tells you the amount of gas and oil your car needs...

 

The problem is that on mine the sticker has both the 2=1050 and the 1=750 values as the dual con was an option on all the models at the time. On mine I painted over the incorrect value on the plate just to be safe.

[Mirez]

Cheers for the replies guys. I went back today and made my points - it was a reasonable conversation although he didn't admit anything and claims to have only put 750g in.... they want the car to examine it on thursday which I think I better let them do.

 

Just so I'm clear though, what exactly is likely to have happened? Whilst I suspect it should have seen the high pressure and stopped the system I don't think it did. :( So...

 

The compressor has tried to compress what exactly? A liquid I'm guessing but what? Refrigerant? Oil? Since liquid can't be compressed its mullered itself and put high pressure out? The exit pipe has then blown as a result? Is anything else likely to be damaged? Seals? Condenser? Evaporator?

 

Cheers all :ph34r:

 

Oh one more question, is it really likely to have popped through a aluminium pipe or it is more likely to be coming from the joint and I just cant see it properly?

Edited June 23, 2009 by Mirez

[gregers]

have your argument ready,coz i susspect they will say theres no way they have caused any damage?reading the posts on here over the years about how expensive repairs cost to the aircon system i dont think there going to put there hands up and say FAIR COP IT WAS OUR MISTAKE,i hope they do fix it for you but dont hold your breathe.

[jkspoff]

OK, here goes maybe a daft question, I was thinking of getting my gas changed, how do you know if you have dual or single A/C ?? Mine has the roof mounted blowers in the rear, does that mean its dual ?

[gregers]

yes i do believe it does.

iirc do you only have 1 rear most opening quater light?

[jkspoff]

Yes, single opening rear quarter light.

[mikej]

With ref to single or dual aircon my understanding is NO roof vents means NO dual aircon , with regards the aircon damage i have be told by several aircon people if you put too much refrigerant/oil in, it will stuff the compressor. Unfortunately i cannot be more specific just too much fluid and it will go pop, I think the correct amount for a single aircon system is 300+- 50g and the oil should be i think 200 mils but need to check, this is for a completely empty system though. As i mentioned mine didn't detect the extra fluid either just went bang, strange how it didn't go whilst at the bloody garage assuming they actually switched it on.

best of luck.

[marinabrid]

how are people getting compressor damage and blown systems due to overfilling if as seatkid says the 3 way pressure switch prevents it working if over or under filled

[Mirez]

how are people getting compressor damage and blown systems due to overfilling if as seatkid says the 3 way pressure switch prevents it working if over or under filled

 

I'm guessing either the limit is set to high or its yet another componenet of dubious vw quality!

[Mirez]

Ok well despite them claiming they "are happy we did nothing wrong" they are going to replace the pipe as a "goodwill" gesture, which to me reads we did f*** up and want to fix it on the cheap.

 

Would you let them replace the pipe? I don't overly want them anywhere near the aircon system now and having seen how involved replacing that pipe looks I certainly don't trust them. Has anyone got the pipe diameter handy? (The pipe in question is the rear pipe as it exits the compressor which go's up to the front left of the engine bay to a valve and come form of chamber)

 

Also likelyhood of compressor failure? Anyway to tell if its screwed without gas in the system?

[jkspoff]

I my opinion you have nothing to loose by letting them have a go, as your A/C is currently not working anyway. Let them do it and you might be pleasantly surprised..... Edited July 1, 2009 by jkspoff

[gregers]

think in all honesty you got a bit of a result,but tell them IT BETTER BE WORKING WHEN ITS HANDED BACK TO YOU :) and you want warrenty on any parts replaced,also if its off the road for a few days get em to chuck in a hire car aswell as its there mess up.

[roumen]

Hi guys,

I had very similar problem - my 2002 TDi Galaxy is a single unit and should be filled 750ml, but KwikFit filled it as dual unit - 1050ml. The guy started the car and I felt for few seconds that the temperature started to go down and then started to blow worm air. I said to the guy "Are u sure it has dual A/C? I think is single..." - although as someone mentioned above on the A/C data plate shows the charging quantities for both... So the guy stopped the car straight away and connected the machine again, emptied the A/C system and did the filling procedure again to 750ml of freon.

 

When done we tested the A/C again and it still was blowing warm air. He said there must be other problem with the A/C and I should check it with specialist (KwikFit only charge and don't repair...)

 

I have a friend abroad, who is A/C engineer (and a good one...) and I explained to him what happened. He asked me to check few things - whether the pulley of the compressor was engaging when i switch on the A/C - which did, meaning all electrics work and the compressor switches on OK. Then he told me to attach a filling hose with a gauge on it (they come wit the refilling cane of refrigerant - available at Halfords) and the gauge went straight on the last red section at approx 120psi - the red section means "May have mechanical probs".

 

The pressure and the dial did not change when i turned the engine on and A/C on and off. My mate told me that that means possibly the valves inside the A/C compressor were busted and the compressor does not pump any pressure any more... Bad news, he said. He also said that this could be repaired, but knowing the prices here in the UK it would cost a fortune... May be a new or reconditioned compressor would be wiser.

 

The problem is that when a compressor (or any other part of the A/C system) is replaced, the system must be purged to clean any particles in the system, than a deep vacuum is applied for 15min or more to clear any air or condensation and then the A/C is re-gassed and re-oiled. Also it is recommended that the Receiver Drier and Expansion Valves are changed when fitting a new A/C Compressor, because contaminated oil trapped in these units will escape the system flush and in time enter the new unit and act as an abrasive.

 

So, we are stuffed totally from such error of the KwikFit guy.

 

Anyway, any one knows a reliable auto A/C engineer on London area (London SW, SW)?

My friend is very good A/C engineer, but is based in Bulgaria...

 

Any advise is welcome. Thanks for you patience to read this!

 

Roumen

Galaxy 1.9 TDi auto 02 - six seater (originally) :P